Grammarsquee!

[amedia]

I have a new post up at fandom_grammar on dangling modifiers. I got some awesome behind-the-scenes help from my fellow grammarians and a stack of resources from TODS, including the splendid Transitive Vampire.

Comments

[amedia.livejournal.com]

a string of relative clauses wherein each refers to the one before

Like the House that Jack Built, right?

This is the maiden all forlorn, who milked the cow with the crumpled horn, who did something else I can't remember with someone who had some other quality I have forgotten, that lived in the house that Jack built?

I can see why you'd call that telescoping. Like the kind of telescope that slides back in on itself.

My mom used to scold me for using "as" to introduce clauses, because it's so ambiguous, so even as an adult, I don't use it. I should tell her that sometime, come to think of it.;

[verilyverity.livejournal.com]

Yep. That's the one. Now imagine that with a bunch of boring as clauses.

[amedia.livejournal.com]

Now imagine that with a bunch of boring as clauses.

I initially read that as "boring-ass clauses" - and yeah, it works both ways, doesn't it!

But "as" clauses aren't relative clauses; relative clauses need to begin with relative pronouns. (I'm trying to remember if we have also relative adjectives in English, but every example I come up with is an interrogative adjective. Dang!)

Maybe it should be an entry on "as" clauses and why they suck, *especially* when they are proceeding in company.

[verilyverity.livejournal.com]

relative clauses need to begin with relative pronouns.

*looks it up* So they do. I think this is where the osmosis thing comes in to trip me up.

So what would you call a subordinate clause that refers directly back to the noun that immediately precedes it, rather than the subject of the main clause?

Besides ill-conceived.

[amedia.livejournal.com]

Depends on what it's doing. Lame sentence examples off the top of my head:

Cain called to DG as she crossed the lake.

Temporal clause. ("as" = "while")

Glitch kept his brain under the bed, as it was well-hidden there.

I forget what you call this. I wanna call it "causative" but I'm sure that's wrong. ("as" = "because")

I'm trying to remember other uses of "as" as a conjunction introducing a subordinate clause. But you'd basically name it according to what it's pretending to be. (ETA: I don't think it matters whether the subject of the subordinate clause is the same as the subject of the sentence, as long as it's unambiguous.)

[verilyverity.livejournal.com]

Boo. I want kicky little nicknames I can haul out instead of long geeky paragraphs out of Strunk and White.

[amedia.livejournal.com]

:-)

You know, you can always submit some examples of the kind of awful sentences you're talking about, and the fan grammarians can try to figure out what to call the problem and turn it into a neat little packaged question. That's what I did with the gerunds-with-possessives question. (There's a closed community to which the grammarians belong where these things are hashed out before answers are posted.)

[verilyverity.livejournal.com]

I'll have to start collecting them.

I'd need to modify it, though, because I usually find them in fic.

[amedia.livejournal.com]

*nod nod* I understand.

[verilyverity.livejournal.com]

Oh! How about the suck that is passive voice?

*scurries off to ask*

[verilyverity.livejournal.com]

PS: Dangling modifier answer was made of win and delicious candy.

[amedia.livejournal.com]

PS: Dangling modifier answer was made of win and delicious candy.

Eeeee! That just made my night. :-D

[verilyverity.livejournal.com]

Mine too, 'cos I have no delicious candy. :(

[lionille.livejournal.com]

This is the cock that crowed in the morn
That woke the priest all shaven and shorn
That married the man all rumpled and torn
That kissed the maiden all forlorn
That milked the cow with the crumpled horn
That tossed the dog
That worried the cat
That killed the rat
That ate the malt
That lay in the house that Jack built.

Sorry. Just wanted to see if I remembered it all. I always liked that rhyme. Except the killing the rat part. I like rats. I usually changed that to ‘chased’ when I was a sensitive little kid, hee. And oh, am I nuts that this makes me want to write Glitch/OFC-milkmaid fic? The once-dashing courtier now in tattered clothes and the humble servant maiden and their forbidden love?

[amedia.livejournal.com]

The once-dashing courtier now in tattered clothes and the humble servant maiden and their forbidden love?

Awww... that would be SWEET!!!!

And I am impressed at your mad memorization skilz!

[lionille.livejournal.com]

Hee! Mind like a steel sieve...

[lionille.livejournal.com]

Actually, I think it might have been "tattered and torn" come to think of it.